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d21demon
06-12-2010, 08:52 AM
Hi guys, just wondering what other vehicles had the d21 box, because the the old nav decided she didn't like the taste of her gearbox and spat it out. The cheapest replacement I have found so far is for $1,500 from the wreckers and I just dont think the old girl is worth the trouble anymore.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Ta Scotty

Pinelli
06-12-2010, 10:33 AM
In 4wd, the pathfinder, terrano.
In 2wd, there were a number of cars, you might find that you can split the rear off of yours and tack it on to the back of the 2WD gearbox.

More modern navaras too will use a gearbox that should swap over fairly easily

What engine do you have? What year? Different engines, different bellhousings, same gearbox. The Z24, KA24 and RB engines all used the same bellhousing. Diesels used another (not sure of SD and TD were the same or different), and the VG30 used a different bellhousing again.

$1500? I was quoted between $500 and $800 locally, (for a 4 cyl petrol 4WD gearbox box) . I was quoted $1500 for a Pathy, minus the panels!

Dave
07-12-2010, 03:39 AM
I thought the TD27 used the same gearbox as the Z24/KA24E. Obviously the belhousing is different.

Dave.

Pinelli
07-12-2010, 06:16 AM
Yeah, I'm pretty sure the early D21s all used the same gearbox, just with different bellhousings. Same gearbox with different bellhousings and a different tail for 2WD purposes in a bunch of cars like the 240SX and 300SX, I think pintara as well, but same internals. 5SW71C or something like that.

Obviously automatic boxes were different :)

Leprechaun
07-12-2010, 06:32 AM
I would expect a 2WD gearbox would have a smaller input shaft.

Where's Dion when you need him.

Pinelli
07-12-2010, 09:26 AM
I hooked a 2wd motor to my 4wd gearbox no worries.

d21demon
07-12-2010, 01:21 PM
engines the old z24 and the utes 4wd

Pinelli
07-12-2010, 02:58 PM
Then any Nissan 4cyl petrol 4WD gearbox should do the trick, from 1986 onwards. Anything using the Z24 or KA24E. Not sure when they stopped using the KA24E. Dave might know.

Dave
08-12-2010, 04:15 AM
What Pinelli said, a TD27 gearbox will work to but the ratios will be slightly different.

Dave.

Dion
10-12-2010, 08:23 AM
Where's Dion when you need him.

Sorry guys, other side of the world.

It depends how greasy you want to get and how much you want to pinch pennies.

You want an FS5W71C with Z/KA bellhousing, fitted to:
D21 4x4 86-96 Z24/KA24E
D21 4x2 86-92 Z24/KA24E
WD21 4x4 86-96 Z24
D22 4x2 97-04 KA24DE

Mildly useful:
E23 4x2 ?? column shift Z24
E24 4x2 ?? column shift Z24
(^Urvans)

Obviously a 4x4 box is less of a risk than a 4x2 box but you can always swap the gearset across and hope the tolerances are similar between the two casings, IF you can't easily swap the casing to accept the transfer case.

You don't really want an FS5W71C with TD bellhousing, fitted to:
D21 4x4 88-96 TD27
D21 4x2 88-96 TD23
WD21 4x4 86-88 TD27
WD21 4x4 88-96 TD27T

But the gearset will interchange.

You could also scrape by with the gearset from a FS5W71C with an SD bellhousing, fitted to:
720 10,000BC-86 SD23/25
D21 4x4 86-88 SD23/25
D21 4x2 86-88 SD23/25

You definitely don't want an FS5R30A with any bellhousing, totally incompatible, as fitted to:
D21 4x2 VG30
D22 4x4 QD32
D22 4x4 ZD30
D22 4x4 VG33

I would steer clear of buying one that hasn't been rebuilt from a wrecker unless you get a sizzling deal, as you'll be back at square one pretty quickly, 200,000 to 300,000 is when these usually spit fifth gear. You can have rebuilt exchange boxes from eBay for about $1500 from time to time, I think that would give you the best bang for buck. And run synthetic gear oil in your new box.

squeak81
11-12-2010, 11:29 AM
Hey guys, same prob here but i think my old girl is worth it. Rebuilt box less than 2 months ago and now she has thrown a bearing plus possibly more. My question is would a auto box out of a terrano more robust and will with stand a thrashing??

OP sorry for hijacking.

Don't always drive her hard but is always carrying a load.

96navara
14-03-2011, 06:10 AM
Hey Dion
What about a FS5W71C box fitted to a TD71C Bellhousing connected to a QD32 with dts Turbo. Mine keeps killing the gearbox. Any ideas?

Dion
14-03-2011, 08:07 AM
Hey Dion
What about a FS5W71C box fitted to a TD71C Bellhousing connected to a QD32 with dts Turbo. Mine keeps killing the gearbox. Any ideas?


Put in a FS5R30A, the FS5W71C should never be behind a QD32T, it's not up to the task at all.

Pinelli
14-03-2011, 02:34 PM
Why do you say that, Dion? They used the 71C in the early Z31 300ZXs with the VG30DETT. They also ran them behind the VG30E in the D21s in the states.

Not saying that you're not right, maybe Nissan shouldn't have used the 71C for those engines. Just saying that they did.

Dion
15-03-2011, 01:01 AM
Why do you say that, Dion? They used the 71C in the early Z31 300ZXs with the VG30DETT. They also ran them behind the VG30E in the D21s in the states.

Not saying that you're not right, maybe Nissan shouldn't have used the 71C for those engines. Just saying that they did.

I'm aware of these applications and the 300ZX guys say the 71C is a good box for their cars. There's two differences - firstly, there is something about our Japanese built FS5W71Cs from 86 to 92 (change to KA) which makes them weaker - might be the oil grade specified or a OE bearing supplier's quality control, not sure exactly but these fail like clockwork. You might have noticed they kept fitting the FS5W71C well into the D22's model run - these don't fail like the early D21 boxes do. Overall same design, but Nissan corrected some minor problem and voila, less than 100% failures.

Also, the application in a fast 300ZX is very different - these cars weigh nothing compared to 3.8T of D21, payload and trailer. Nothing will kill an underspecc'd box better than high torque and a high resistance to that torque, again and again and again and again (traffic lights with a car trailer)... and these utes do real work.

As for 96Navara's car - you could comfortably tow three tonne with a QD32T. That's somewhere in the range of 5T GCM, well beyond what the 71C was designed for. My advice in a nutshell is to fit a FS5R30A so he can avoid stressing about a box rebuild every time he hooks a trailer on. What he saves on rebuilds will pay for a 30A, even at wrecker prices.

96navara
15-03-2011, 10:48 PM
thanks dion
do you know if any mounts have to be changed to fit the 30a to my d21 and will it fit my bellhousing td71c and transfer case.
thanks again budy

Dion
15-03-2011, 11:00 PM
do you know if any mounts have to be changed to fit the 30a to my d21

Mount holes on transmission cross member need to be filled and redrilled, I think the total translation is about 30mm or 40mm (the 30A is longer than the 71C).

and will it fit my bellhousing td71c and transfer case.


Doubtful. What you're looking to buy is a gearbox with bellhousing and transfer case. It's still a TX10A transfer but the flange pattern is different.

thanks again budy

No worries mate.

bloodviper
18-03-2011, 02:29 PM
Hey dion i have a td25 with a 5speed and i have a auto off a z24 can i just switch boxs and keep the bellhousing from the td and use the auto box

Dion
18-03-2011, 03:03 PM
Hey dion i have a td25 with a 5speed and i have a auto off a z24 can i just switch boxs and keep the bellhousing from the td and use the auto box

Not sure mate, assuming that your torque convertor bolts to your TD25 crankshaft, you might be able to bolt them together. If you've got both sit them side by side and have a look. I've never had an auto Navara trans even just to look at.

Pinelli
18-03-2011, 11:52 PM
I've got an auto here to go into my Nav instead of a manual. I think the belhousings come off differently. I suspect you can't do it easily.

Dave
19-03-2011, 03:04 AM
^ If you have the time, can you grab pics of the trans and bolting pattern and throw it in the D21 bible.

Which I have to stick that to.

Pinelli
19-03-2011, 04:38 AM
Yeah, no worries. Was planning to do that when I had the two of them out side by side, but that date seems to be a long time coming ...

aravanavara
27-04-2011, 08:44 AM
the z24 box is in vl commodores i think. stuck on an rb30. there's a lot of them around. i think patrols use the r30a, but i'm not sure. i found this thread because i'm trying to find other buyers. if the info helps a guy offered me 350 for my fs5w71c so the mark up would be massive i'm sure. 1500 seems to be the going rate for a reco.

Pinelli
27-04-2011, 03:22 PM
rb30 and z24 (and KA24) share the same bellhousing bolt pattern as far as I can find.
I was told $800 from the wreckers for a non-reco gearbox, if they ever got one in which was rare.

unkn0wn
08-05-2011, 03:00 PM
Hi Guys,

Does the the FS5W71C have the same gear ratios across the board? Ie for td27/Sd25 and Ka 24?

Is the 4wd transfer the same from the 4cylinder d21's to the 6cylinder Vg's?

Are the mounting points the same for the 4cylinder gearbox and 4wd box from the d21's to the 6cylinder Vg's?

Christian

Dion
08-05-2011, 03:20 PM
Does the the FS5W71C have the same gear ratios across the board? Ie for td27/Sd25 and Ka 24?


4x4 and 4x2 are different but for a given year, the ratios are the same between diesel and petrol.


Is the 4wd transfer the same from the 4cylinder d21's to the 6cylinder Vg's?


No D21 4x4 VGs were ever made. The VG33E in 4x4 came in the D22, this does use a TX10A the same as the four cylinder models, but the front flange pattern is different.


Are the mounting points the same for the 4cylinder gearbox and 4wd box from the d21's to the 6cylinder Vg's?


See above. 35mm difference on the gearbox mount (FS5R30A is a longer box)

Dave
09-05-2011, 07:51 AM
The D22 series 1 ran the VG30E in the 4wd model.

Series 2 and on the VG30E was only a 2wd engine as the VG33E was the new 4wd petrol engine.

beano
18-01-2012, 07:35 AM
Hey guys, does anyone know if the VG33E 4WD gearbox will bolt up to a VG30E ??

I've recently bought a VG30E from 1986ish Z31 300ZX and wanted to drop it into my D21 thats currently got a Z24 and 4x4 FS5W71C 5sp gearbox.

I've been told I shouldn't try and run the VG30E in front of the standard W71C because it will break it in no time, although I'm a bit confused because I've also rear that the stock Z31 300ZX and a VL Commodore RB30E gearbox is a W71C as well. And I'm thinking if the box survives behind both of those 3 litre engines, it should survive when fitted up to the VG30E whilst in my D21. I understand the D21 is a heaver vehicle, so the box will cop more wear and tear because of this, but thought that if it's not having the clutch dropped continuously, it should be alright. What do u guys think?

I've been told to run a V6 box or else it won't last, but I'm struggling to find a 4WD VG30 g'box, so thought a VG33 box might bolt up.

Cheers

Dave
18-01-2012, 08:02 AM
Dont forget the extra load on the gearbox in the 4wd's.

Ie, bigger tyres, heavier, especially loaded with a tonne on the back.

The VG33E gearbox would bolt up to the VG30E D22 or R50 Pathfinder engine.

Not sure about the Z31 engine.

SR20's had different blocks depending on the model it was fitted to.

Ie, U13 Bluebird Attessa's, N14 GTIR's had the same bellhousing pattern. RWD SR20's are different so I hear.

Who knows with Nissan.

Dion
18-01-2012, 01:45 PM
+1 with what Dave said - torque is what kills these boxes and it's not uncommon for D21s to tow two or three tonnes (slowly), have a tonne on the back, and do it all in fifth uphill with a headwind, which is where you're putting every last bit of torque the engine has through the gearbox and onto the road.

The way to work it out is to download the 300zx Nissan workshop manual, go to the MT - Installation section and look at the bellhousing flange pattern. Then do the same with the D22, and if you have a match then it's worth a try. You still might have issues with the clutch and shafts, but that'll have to be trial and error.